Episode 11: Sylvia Unthank, Animal Rescuer and Equestrian

INTRO: Welcome to the Trailblazers Podcast series by Periplum, sharing the experiences of trailblazers living and working in the Tees Valley: the innovators, activists, workers and adventurers as told in their own words. Episode 11 Sylvia Unthank Jackie (Interviewer) I'm just going to introduce myself so my name's Jackie Martin, and I'm part of the Trailblazers Heritage project, focusing on Tees women who have been adventurers and inspirational to others. So this morning, I'm going to…have a chat with Sylvia. So, Sylvia, can I just get you to tell me your full name and your date of birth please? Sylvia (Interviewee) Sylvia Unthank, 31st of the 7 37 [31.7.1937] Jackie (Interviewer) Thank you. So we're just going to get a little bit of information about you as a person and the things that you've done in your life and things that have been important to you and what you've been passionate about, if that's okay. So the first question I'm going to ask you, Sylvia, is where were you born and what are your earliest memories of being very young? Sylvia (Interviewee) I was born in 31 Edale Avenue, Flixton, in the outskirts of Manchester. Jackie (Interviewer) And your earliest memories? Sylvia (Interviewee) I was an only one. And my mother used to take me to the Gardener's Institute when I was about three. It was a dancing class: Miss Holiday's dancing class - two sisters -, where we did limbering and all sorts of things...ballet, mainly. And then, when I was about five, my uncle, mother's brother was in Merchant Navy. And I can remember when Manchester burnt Jackie (Interviewer) Oh Sylvia (Interviewee) Because my mother carried me out into the shelter on the outside and I could see the sky was red. So that was a very vivid memory. And I used to worry about my Uncle Jack, because he was in the merchant ship. And so I decided to.. I was about five when I decided to go collecting. So I got an old cocoa tin and knocked a slot in the top, and I went round collecting for the Merchant Navy, which my mother sent off, and I've still got the letter from them now thanking. It was about £3.49 that I collected. Jackie (Interviewer) Right Sylvia (Interviewee) But [a] penny was a was a penny then, you know, worth something. Even bread was only fourpence ha'penny and that's old money, Jackie (Interviewer) Right Sylvia (Interviewee) You know, so. Jackie (Interviewer) But those are, those are real vivid, strong memories that you can… Sylvia (Interviewee) They were Vivid strong memories. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) And then I then I went to another dancing class when I was about ten. Where I learned to tap dance. I learned to tap dance there, and.. me mother took me to competitions and things like that. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah Sylvia (Interviewee) But he didn't have a car, so it was an all day event, you know, and both my mother and father sang, and they used to sing at Eisteddfods. So…there again it was a full day, a full day because we didn't have a car so if it was somewhere in like Alderley Edge, it used to take us all day to get there and get back. Jackie (Interviewer) Right. You've always had a big love of…you were telling me before, Sylvia.. of animals. Can you tell me… how that developed and when that developed, when you were younger? Sylvia (Interviewee) Me father actually had chronic bronchial asthma, so I wasn't allowed any animals. But, I kept pinching animals from the outside and bringing them in. So, in the end, they got me a cat called Patsy, that I used to dress up and put it in the pram and [laughs] get round. And then I also had some rabbits, Tommy and Topsy, they were…Dutch rabbits, but they did seem to get out of the pen quite a lot. And then one day a policeman came and took them away Jackie (Interviewer) Oh Sylvia (Interviewee) ‘Cos he said he kept rabbits. So, he said, so he kept me rabbits. So, so that was it. Oh, and then with Miss Holiday's dancing class, I was chosen to bring in the New Year at the John Alker Hall in Flixton, and had to learn off this, this postcard, these, all these words and…being forced to read all these words, time and time again. And there was… I was a new year, and there was old Father Time, you know, taking out the old year. And, and then we went to a party afterwards.. somebody's house, and it was absolutely freezing. And I had to had to perform again, in me ballet tutu. And it was very, very cold [laughs] in the bedroom. Anyway…when I was about 14, I decided I would look after everybody's animals when they went on holiday. So, I decided to start a business. So, me dad and I made some kennels in the shed, and I looked after me friend's dog. He was called Bruce, and he was lovely. But…unfortunately when they let him out, he came back to our house every morning at 9 O’Clock-he was there at the back door. And I also looked after another friend's dog, and cat. Now the cat was a ginger tom and he was full of scabs, you know, he was a..was a.. he'd been a fighter and he was a right mess. And and I looked after the …spaniel as well. But, unfortunately, they had him looking beautiful, mind you. And then unfortunately…he got out just before they.. they came home. But he came back to me, didn't try and make his way home, he came Jackie (Interviewer) Yeh Sylvia (Interviewee) ..he came, he came back to me. I used to charge 14 shillings, which is old money, 14 shillings for dogs.. 7 shillings for cats, 5, 5 shillings for rabbits, and a shilling for fish. And me friend had a rabbit…and, and it was a giant chinchilla. And it was the most vicious rabbit you could ever see in his life. It actually bit me dog. It was, it was a terrible rabbit. Anyway, I had, had that one for a week, as well. So I didn't, I didn't get any fish. I didn't get any fish to look after. But...a year later, I found a letter that somebody in, in my father's office had sent me a letter asking me to look after their animals, but I never got the letter [laughs] Jackie (Interviewer) Oh dear Sylvia (Interviewee) I found it [laughs] Jackie (Interviewer) Yeh Sylvia (Interviewee) I never got the letter. I think, I think that.. my parents had had enough. You know? [laughs] Jackie (Interviewer) [laughs] So did you have any of your own.. animals then as a youngster…apart from yer rabbits Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes Jackie (Interviewer) and yer cats? Sylvia (Interviewee) No the rabbits had gone. And ..I had a little dog called Paddy- we got him from the back of the market at Liverpool..in Liverpool, where I used to go dancing, because after I left one dancing class, I went to another one, my aunt’s best friend was a, a dancing teacher and she lived in Liverpool, so I used to go to Liverpool every Saturday with me father and…and then one day we came back via… the market and we brought Paddy. He was, he was the liveliest of the whole bunch, anyway we got him. He was a little, a little terrier. We called him Paddy Isiah because he had a..brown spot over his, over his eye. One eye looked as if it was higher than the other. [laughs] Jackie (Interviewer) [laughs] Sylvia (Interviewee) So, and I can remember when I went to school, I went to a grammar school and…I can remember, one day I got to school and found he’d followed me, from a distance. I saw him coming down the main corridor in the school, so I had to take it back home again. Jackie (Interviewer) [laughs] Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes. We went on holiday once when I was about 11 or 12. We were in…Nefyn, and.. there was a riding school in Morfa Nefyn. I was there in for a fortnight and I learned to ride, just the basic things. And then, and I always, I always wanted a horse. Now my father, when I was 15, was very poorly for about three months, he was in bed for about three months, and…with his breathing, I think, I think he got pneumonia and pleurisy. He was really poorly. Actually, we wouldn't let him smoke anymore, so we didn't give him any cigarettes, so he gave up smoking. And then…and then, of course.. I used, I used to go and help in the local stables, you know, and, and then they moved, they actually moved to Durham in Cheshire. Dunham it was called, not Durham, Dunham in Cheshire. And they used to pick me up every, every Saturday and Sunday and all the school holidays at 7 o’clock in the morning. I used to make me sandwiches and then I was there til 7 o’clock at night. They brought me home at night, and I used to work all day at the stables, and…occasionally, very occasionally, I got a half an hour's free ride. So. So that was it. So I did that until, until I was 15, coming up 16, and I persuaded my father to buy me, to buy me a horse, a pony. And I said I'd never ask for anything else. I won't ask for any clothes, I won't ask for anything else ever, as long as I can have this pony. So… I went to the council and persuaded a gentleman from the council called Mr. Houseman, if he would let me have a field. So he let me have a field nearby, for a peppercorn rent so my father and I went to the auction rooms, on our own, and I didn't see anything I liked. And then suddenly a horsebox came in with two ponies: one was a chestnut, one was black. And they weren't facing the front, they were facing the back, and as soon as the ramp went down, I said, I want that one. Anyway, we bid for her, and we got her. And then after we got her that, they told us that she'd kill somebody with a kicking and she'd kick a stable down. Jackie (Interviewer) Right Sylvia (Interviewee) You know so.. anyway, I had fun and games with her actually, but then, I loved her to bits. I loved her to bits. But there again, I had to…fence a field. Now, my father wasn't well enough to help, so the council dropped off some posts and, and a big roll of barbed wire.. and so meself and me friend, we were only 15, we did the fencing ourselves, wielding a 12 pound hammer. Jackie (Interviewer) Wow Sylvia (Interviewee) And I managed to do that. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeh Sylvia (Interviewee) And then a gentleman from the field next door, he was with the Sea Scouts. He had a wire tightener, so he tightened it while we put the staples in, and then I found that she…she could get out, put her head under the top wire, and she didn't care if she got ripped from top to bottom, you know. Jackie (Interviewer) Right Sylvia (Interviewee) So then I used to have to tie the wires together, you know. Jackie (Interviewer) What was she called your horse? Sylvia (Interviewee) Black Jess. Jackie (Interviewer) Black Jess Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes she was called Black Jess. Yes…so I had a lot of fun and games with her. She was she was about 14 hands that was all. I did enter 1 or 2 shows with her. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) But there again I had to hack there. So, you know, if you've done an 11mile hack and then do a show, and then come back home, it’s Jackie (Interviewer) Yeh Sylvia (Interviewee) It's quite, it's quite tiring for them. So… Jackie (Interviewer) So riding has been a big thing in your life. Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes. Jackie (Interviewer) It’s been one of the things that you've carried on doing? Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes. Yes. And then I, I left school and I got a job, I worked in a…sewing machine showroom, an industrial sewing machine showroom and that was dishing out parts so I learned what went wrong with them and…and it was a dead end job so I got into the job at working for the Cotton Board. And then I got another job and I worked for David Rosenfields. So I went to night school for…bookkeeping, and I worked in the accounts and we did Henleys and the Passing Joys. Now Henleys used to sell Jaguars, Passing joys used to sell Armstrong Siddeleys and David Rosenfield used to sell Rolls-Royce and Rovers. And people used to come and pay in cash, you know. And at that time a Rolls-Royce was £2,000. Jackie (Interviewer) Right. Sylvia (Interviewee) A rover would be around about 600 [£600]. And so, I used to go and count the cash and take it to the bank.. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah Sylvia (Interviewee) And things like that. So, I enjoyed my job. Now while I was there, I met, I met a Danish boy called Peter Martinez and, and a French boy called Jean Martinet. They were there on works experience. And me father quite liked the Danish boy, but he wasn't keen on the Frenchman. So I thought, well, I'd never been anywhere, I'd never been anywhere or done anything, so I decided I should go abroad. So I decided to go to Denmark. And Peter and his family, found me a job in a, on an estate called, Rolliker. And…it was right in the country and one of the islands. And I was there as a children's nurse and, sort of, I was there for a couple of months. They did have a horse there, called Ludovic but they were plough horses. Ludovic wasn't quite as heavy as the other two, and he used to hold back a bit and let the other two horses do the work. And so he actually had a saddle, so I managed to take him out, Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah Sylvia (Interviewee) And because he, I managed to stop him running off with me…the little old horse man thought I was the bee's knees [laughs] because I'd managed Ludovic. And so after that, I went to work in, an agricultural college, in the kitchens and I was there a year. And there again, they had, they had a horse that, it didn't have a saddle, but I took it out anyway. And, and actually I, I just, I just rode it bareback into the woods and I came across an elk, you know.. Jackie (Interviewer) Incredible Sylvia (Interviewee) It was really lovely. You know, something like that happening. So I was there for, for a year, and I made some good friends. I made some good friends. But we worked from 6 o’clock in the morning until about 2 o’clock and then 5 o’clock until about half past 7 or something like that. All for the princely sum of £5 a month. Anyway, I decided I wanted to do something else, so I applied for a job at a publishers to work in the accounts. Two nice ladies interviewed me, and I got the job, but just before I was due to start, the criminal police came and told me I couldn't have the job, because I would be taking the job from some Danish person. So, at that stage, I was jobless in Copenhagen. No friends or anything. It wasn't a very good time, that time, but I managed to…Peter's family. He had a, he had a little wooden bungalow at the end of their garden-he was in Switzerland at the time, and that, I stayed in there, until I found another job, so I did, I went as an au pair, for a bit. And then when I left that job, I, I went to visit one of me friends that had worked at Nesco, at the farm, and she said, well, she was working for Johannes Fønss, he was the, he was a retired director of the Royal Opera House and his wife was Dorothy Larsen, and she'd been an opera singer. And she said, oh, well, we're short of a cook, they can't keep staff here because of the daughter. She was she was about 12, looking like 21she was much, a lot bigger than me. And so anyway, Fru Fønss he did say to me, yes, I think I can give you a job, but I won't be employing a cook for when we have parties or dinner parties, can you manage? And I said, oh, yes, like you do. And, so I was there for quite, quite some time and it was quite interesting because I did meet film stars and, you know, actors and actresses, you know, it was great. And then because he'd retired, [the] cast had bought him a summer house up in Skerne in the north of Jutland. And we went up there and, and we, we stopped in the car before and Fru Fønss and said, go and get everything in that shop you need for the kitchen. Well, it was like being in a sweetshop. [laughs] You know, I picked everything out new for the kitchen and things like that. And then… Jackie (Interviewer) Can you remember how much did you spend? Sylvia (Interviewee) No, I can't remember how much I spent. There was also something before that I’d forgotten about. During the war, my father belonged to a concert party. It was…the government had these, they wanted people to have concert parties to go and visit the army camps and things like that. So he joined a concert party called the Manhattan Follies. He was a very good bass baritone. And of course, I'd be about 10 at the time. And they used to take me, now and again, but you had to be 12 really to perform, but they used to stick me on now and again. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah Sylvia (Interviewee) I used to do the Minuet and sing. Me mother had made me a crinoline out of muslin nappies, because material was on coupons and the only thing you could buy were muslin nappies that weren't on coupons. Jackie (Interviewer) Right. Yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) And so she, she dyed them all lemon, and I had this lovely crinoline with frills all the way round. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) So that came out now and again. I think me mother wanted to be another Shirley Temple. Jackie (Interviewer) Did she? Sylvia (Interviewee) But I was more interested in horses, you know. Yes. Yes Jackie (Interviewer) [laughs]. So at what age have you ridden horses up till then? When was the last time that you… Sylvia (Interviewee) Well I was…I started when I was on holiday when I was about 11. And, through the years, even if I didn't have a horse, I'd have me jodhpurs in the bottom of the case, just in case I met one, you know. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah [laughs]. Sylvia (Interviewee) Yeah, that's what it’s like. Jackie (Interviewer) So, when was the last time you got on a horse?...How old were you? When you… Sylvia (Interviewee) How old am I now? Was it last year? Jackie (Interviewer) So it was about a year ago. Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes I was about…85 I think. Jackie (Interviewer) Right Sylvia (Interviewee) About 85. But… I could still ride anything, but it's the getting on and getting off… Jackie (Interviewer) Right Sylvia (Interviewee) is a problem, because of my hips. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) Once I get on, I'm fine, I can only ride a very narrow horse now. Jackie (Interviewer) Right [laughs]. Sylvia (Interviewee) Unfortunately. But I still…you know, I still want to ride. If I can find a horse that’s narrow enough. I will still ride. Jackie (Interviewer) So… we were talking about like, your love of animals. So you spoke about the horses, and you've still got a dog? Sylvia (Interviewee) I met my husband and, and we got married. And then… my little dog, a little dog, he died. He’d be about 13 and he died. And then we didn't have a dog for a bit. And then I had Janie. And then he heard about a dog that needed a home. And, it's only a few months old he's already had a a couple of homes. He was quite destructive, he was called Worthington, and he was a cross boxer. Jackie (Interviewer) Right. Sylvia (Interviewee) They’re difficult to train at the best of times. And so we went on a train and we got this, we got this dog. And then I had another child, and then my husband's parents had a house in…in Redcar that they, they used to come to for holidays. And so, Geoff got a job at the Head Wrightsons and we came up here and we had another five children after that, had another five children, and then…oh before then, before then, when I was in Manchester, I didn't have a car, so… I, I decided to get a driving license so I worked in the Birkenhead Shop at Debenhams to save up me lessons, and then I passed me test. And then I went for a job as a sales rep with a, it had a car, so luckily I got, I got that job. I think there were 52 applicants, but I managed to get that job, I think because I'd been around a bit by that time. Jackie (Interviewer) [Laughs] Sylvia (Interviewee) And and I enjoyed it. And guess what? I was in Bolton one day, I told them my name and she said, are you Tommy Dunn's daughter? I said, yes, and she was one of the the troop from that from the Manhattan Follies. There were three sisters that I was actually in awe of, because I was only ten at the time, and the youngest one was 15, Stella and they were trapeze artists, used to be either called the Bolton Sisters or the Johnson sisters. You know, out of the blue, I just came across her, so that was lovely to see. And of course, I always had a dog. I always had rescue dogs. I had some lovely dogs, beautiful dogs. Jackie (Interviewer) So would you tend to go for more for the rescues then? Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes. I always went for rescue. Always. I always went for rescue dogs. I had a beautiful Rough Collie, called Tessa. She was, she was absolutely gorgeous. But they don't live too long. She died when she was 12. And I also had, an Alsatian called Trojan, had him till he was 12 as well. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Did you rescue any other animals apart from…dogs? Sylvia (Interviewee) No…a lot of birds. Jackie (Interviewer) Right. Sylvia (Interviewee) A lot of birds. A lot of birds up from the beach. The oiled birds, we used to get oiled Guillemots. Jackie (Interviewer) Right. Sylvia (Interviewee) And I used to, I used to clean them up and then take them to a bird lady in Saltburn. You know, she used to look after them, but I always used to, to rescue them and clean them up. And…anything like wood pigeon sort of thing. Anything.. I rescued any sort of bird. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) And I kept them in the greenhouse, but my husband wasn't too keen on that. And then, as my children grew up, I got a job as an insurance agent working for the Co-Op. I did that for four years, and while I was doing that, I actually went, I started going to night school for art, and when I was doing the night school, I noticed they were fencing. I went to buy dogs and there were fencing down in the hall and I thought, well, I fancy doing that. So I joined the fencing club, and then eventually I took me coach’s ticket. And then then I taught at Newlands for a bit. You know, which was interesting. And then, and I started to play squash. I had problems at first. I'm not a very good ball player, but I persevered. And then I used to play number five for the Ladies team at Redcar Rugby Club. And then, me daughter started doing work for the TV, Extra Film, so I got an agent in Manchester and, I've done about 3 films, I think, and quite a lot of extra work on, on things like Jackie (Interviewer) Wow Sylvia (Interviewee) Brookside Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah Sylvia (Interviewee) and Coronation Street and things, and things like that. And then, also, I've done a lot of shows. I joined, before I came up to, to Middlesbrough, I joined the…Urmston Operatic Society, and I did two shows there. One was ‘Most Happy Fella’ and the other one was the ‘King and I’. I used to sing and I used to, I used to dance as well. So, since being up here, I've done another 17 shows with Redcar, Teesside and Middlesbrough Operatic Society and now I'm in 3 choirs. I joined 3 choirs. I was in White Rose, Saltburn Solstice and Mosaic, but I've now just doing the singing for pleasure on a Monday, so we're still doing little, concerts now and again, you know, which I enjoy. And I do help doing the gardens in the village. They're always nice people, and it's nice to give something back. Jackie (Interviewer) Yep, yeah. Do you think that…what you’re doing, do you think that this is a generation thing that's, that's not gonna sort of happen anymore? Is it something.. Sylvia (Interviewee) No, I think so… Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah Sylvia (Interviewee) I think so. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Have you noticed any changes, any differences in how, you know, how you were growing up and…and now. Sylvia (Interviewee) The they don't like the outdoor life, do they? You know, they're too interested on, in phones, so they don't have a proper childhood. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. You think that… Sylvia (Interviewee) They miss out, they’ve missed out so much on life Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) Really Jackie (Interviewer) Right Sylvia (Interviewee) You know Jackie (Interviewer) What do you think that outdoor life gave you, in terms of…making you the person that you are? What do you think your childhood gave you, and the people who were around you at the time? Sylvia (Interviewee) Well, of course I was. When I was growing up, televisions weren't around, and you played out and you played out with your friends, you roller skated and all that stuff, and played hide and seek. And, and if you wanted to go for a picnic, you'd have a bottle of water and a jam sandwich. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) You know, and then you could be gone all day and it was quite safe. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) Oh, and then when I retired, when I was 60, I decided I would get a horse again. And, and he was lovely. He was an, he was an Arab cross and I had 16 wonderful years with him and.. he actually, no I think probably more, he actually died of wobbler syndrome but he used to do all his dressage movements, because they do these naturally but he never, never did it to order, he did when he thought he would, you know. So, I had a lot of.. I do miss him and I had a lot of fun on him. Jackie (Interviewer) What was he called? Sylvia (Interviewee) Nizanne. Jackie (Interviewer) Nizanne. Sylvia (Interviewee) Nizanne yes. He was a grey, he was lovely. Yeah. Jackie (Interviewer) So just going back to the birds, I mean, I'm obviously aware that, you had chickens at points as well, didn't you, yeh? Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes, I did have chickens. I had chickens before I went to, we went to South Africa. Oh yes. I've forgotten that. We went to South Africa in 1991 because Geoff's job took him there. And, by that time I'd got, I'd got two chickens which the family looked after while, you know, while I was away, Molly…they were Molly and Polly the first. And, and while I was in South Africa, I, I came across the SPCA and…I went to work for them, doing voluntary work for a year. Jackie (Interviewer) And what sort of work were they doing? Sylvia (Interviewee) It's like RSPCA. Jackie (Interviewer) Oh right so…with animals. Sylvia (Interviewee) With animals with, with dogs, horses, cats and anything, you know- we had an odd sheep in sometimes- and tortoises. You know, anything, that came in from the township you know, we, we sort of looked after. Jackie (Interviewer) Right. Sylvia (Interviewee) And so that was interesting. I did get to go into the townships, sometimes, but it was with, a policeman with a big gun, you know… Jackie (Interviewer) Right- how was that? Is there any sort of barriers there, in just being a woman going into the township? Sylvia (Interviewee) No, I was just going into the townships. It wasn’t particularly safe. It wasn't. It wasn't particularly safe, you know. But we were all right if we had the police with us, you know. Jackie (Interviewer) Right OK Sylvia (Interviewee) But it was, it was awkward sometimes because you'd you'd go out the night and then and then you'd be driving home and, and you'd see a, see a notice to a certain place and you didn't know if it was a township or not. Jackie (Interviewer) Right Sylvia (Interviewee) You soon, you soon found out if you went into a big hollow in the road. Oh, I'm in the wrong place here and turn round and I think [Laughs] I've come back. Yeh. Yeh. Yeh. Jackie (Interviewer) Just by the road you knew where you were, yeh? Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes. So I used to…I used to ride. I used to ride there, a friend of mine there, she’d, she'd got some ex racehorses I used to ride every morning, before I went to the SPCA, I used to go up at 7:30. I used to drive my husband to work, and then I used to ride in the morning, before I went to the SPCA. Jackie (Interviewer) So did you work there every day? Yes. Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes, I would have worked at weekends if they'd let me. You know, I just sort of.. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah Sylvia (Interviewee) I saved a lot of animals. I saved and and I put the, the takings up to 170%. Jackie (Interviewer) Wow. Sylvia (Interviewee) So because in the end, they gave me a badge which said ‘pet adoption consultant’. Jackie (Interviewer) Oh [Laughs] Sylvia (Interviewee) Because I, because I had the time, I had the time, and I knew the, I got to know the dogs very well and I could sort of pair them up with the right families, you know. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Yeah. Fantastic. Yes. Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes it was very interesting. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) Heartbreaking sometimes, but very rewarding. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah. So that sort of naturally leads onto the dog that you've got now. How did you end up getting your current dog? Sylvia (Interviewee) Oh well I got me current dog because I had a little rescue dog and…she got skin cancer and it spread, and so I lost her. Now, I had had a dog with me daughter, we shared a dog. And I had her during the day, when the, when the children were little, as a puppy we had her, then had her during the day but I was so lonely at night. And then it was Emily me granddaughter heard about this dog, and she put my name forward to a fellow called Craig Hornby, who knew about this dog that was, was in Saudi Arabia. That had been very, very badly treated. So they put my name forward and I was interviewed. They interviewed a few people, and, and I got her. And when she came in, when she came in, I said, she's a Saluki, you know, and she's actually as big as me when she stands up. Jackie (Interviewer) [Laughs] Sylvia (Interviewee) She's, she's a lovely dog, but she's, she's she was very reactive to other dogs. But we cope with that and she's lovely, I wouldn't be without her. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah Sylvia (Interviewee) I wouldn't be without her. Jackie (Interviewer) And what's your dog's name? What’s she called? Sylvia (Interviewee) Poppy. Jackie (Interviewer) Poppy. Sylvia (Interviewee) Poppy. Yeah. Jackie (Interviewer) Yes. So, looking back on your life, Sylvia, what would you say, has inspired you to do the things that you've done? What, or who, has inspired you to do the things you do or develop the passions that you've developed? Sylvia (Interviewee) [Sighs] Well…as an only one. People tend to have to do something with somebody else, and they won't do it on their own, but I've been forced, because I was an only one I had no back up, Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah Sylvia (Interviewee) you know, of a sibling, I had to do it on my own. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah Sylvia (Interviewee) So…this is why I went into different things, I didn't wait for anybody else to come with me. Jackie (Interviewer) Fantastic. Yeh. Sylvia (Interviewee) Even when even when I went abroad, you know, I went on my own. It was heartbreaking for the first six months, but in actual fact I was going to go for six months, but I didn't come back till I was completely happy living in Denmark and I was there for two years, two months and nine days, and made some lovely friends. Jackie (Interviewer) Great. Have you experienced any barriers in your life, like, in terms of being a woman and has anyone made it hard for you to, to sort of get on because of that? Sylvia (Interviewee) Yes, they did. One of the barriers I did come across is when I, I was working for the co-op and I was just filling in for my agent who had been poorly. He'd been poorly, and it turned out he had TB. And then when I applied for the job, you know, permanent, the proper job. They wanted, they wanted a male of around about 26, married, with two children. That's what they wanted. And I did go in and I went to see the manager and I thumped the desk, to be honest with you. I said, ‘Mr. Fisher, there's nobody more qualified for this job, considering you know absolutely nothing about insurance’, so he didn't dare give it to anybody else. [Laughs] So I…this is my advice to my family. You know, if you think you're being badly treated, thump the desk. Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah, right. Yeah. Have you achieved everything that you've wanted to achieve, so far in your life? Or is there anything else that you think I would like to be able to do that? Sylvia (Interviewee) Well, I wanted to learn to ski, and I wanted to swim with dolphins - that was on me bucket list, but I can't do either of those now because of me knees and me hips Jackie (Interviewer) [Laughs] Sylvia (Interviewee) And everything else. You know, I can't do these things. So that's the only thing. And ride in a rodeo, that was another thing I wanted to do. Jackie (Interviewer) [Laughs and claps] Is there anything else that you want to mention that we haven't sort of touched on today? Is there anything…because I know you wrote a few bits and pieces down, so I'm very mindful of the fact that, you know, this is your story, it’s… Sylvia (Interviewee) Did I tell you that me mother wanted me to be like Shirley Temple? Jackie (Interviewer) Yeah, yeah… you did yeah. Sylvia (Interviewee) Yeah…only I wasn't. I was a tomboy, I was a tomboy. Jackie (Interviewer) Thank, thank goodness. [Laughs] Sylvia (Interviewee) [Laughs] I was a tomboy. I used to go and work on the farm when I got me pony. I used to go, you know, to the farm in Cheshire and sometimes take the rides out there, when they had the riding school there and I used to work, work on the farm driving the tractors. It's, you know, in the summer, in the summer I used to help with the hay making and things like that. Jackie (Interviewer) Wow. Sylvia we wouldn't have enough tape to continue…your life has been very eventful. [Laughs] Thank you. Sylvia (Interviewee) Well, well.. I’ve done a lot of things. OUTRO: Thank you for listening to Periplum’s Trailblazers Podcasts funded by the National Lottery Heritage Fund. To listen to more of the series, and follow our projects visit our website at periplumheritage.com