Episode 21: Sophie McKenna, Campaign Manager for Power of Women

INTRO: Welcome to the Trailblazers Podcast series by Periplum, sharing the experiences of trailblazers living and working in the Tees Valley: the innovators, activists, workers and adventurers as told in their own words. Episode 21 Sophie McKenna, Campaign Manager for Power of Women Lynne [Interviewer] So we’re in Marske in Redcar & Cleveland. We'll just start with a bit of background. What was your childhood like? Sophie [Interviewee] So I grew up in a little village called Brotton, and I went to a Church of England school, which was wonderful. It was called St.Peter's, and it's still there now and it was a very happy, nurturing place to go to school. It's very small, quite insular, because it was just people from the village, but it was very happy. There was lots of happy memories of going to church and singing around the piano with the headmaster. Lots of performances, harvest festivals, maypole dancing. Very quaint.[laughs] And it was very joyful and yeah, just a gorgeous childhood. Then our secondary school, I went to Warsett so it had then changed into Freeborough and against very small 500 people in the whole school. So yeah, I lived, we lived within the village and went to school with lots of other children from the village, so everybody knew everybody. My dad was the local milkman. Yeah. So very community orientated and lovely. You know, I can't complain about my childhood at all. There are lots of happy memories of playing out and being very nurtured at school and looked after, but very insular and just within Brotton in the local area. And yeah, so there was that. But no, a very happy childhood in - lovely and enjoyed education and being amongst my peers. Yeah, lovely Lynne [Interviewer] What was family life like? Sophie McKenna [Interviewee] Yes. So I have an older sister who's six years older than me, mum and dad and- very happy. Lots of nice memories of going on holiday. My dad was the milkman. My mum worked for the Evening Gazette and then worked in the local college, lived next door to a lovely family who had children similar ages to us and I spent a lot of time at their house. We both were very fortunate that we had nice houses, a big garden, so we spent a lot of time in the garden playing together, and I would often go out with their family away on trips during the summer holidays. Their mum would take us all over and put ice creams into the park, and I was very much a part of their sort of extended family as well as my own. So yeah, loving family, very fortunate, very happy and well looked after and nurtured and I believed I could do whatever I wanted to do, really. Lynne [Interviewer] And then when you left school, how did your career progress? Sophie [Interviewee] So when I left school, I went to college at Prior Pursglove and that was a very different experience to secondary school. And I did actually struggle a bit. I didn't really enjoy college, I was always quite academic and I did A-levels but struggled maybe with, like, making new friends in the friendships there and the dynamics of college. I think that I always quite liked the structure of school, so going into that environment where it's a lot more independent learning, making new friends, friends from out of the area as well, in the towns. Like looking back, I probably did struggle with that quite a bit. My first year was very successful. I spent a lot of time in the library. I was quite a dedicated student and then in my second year I discovered nightclubbing.[laughs] So I was fortunate that I had done really, really well in my first year because at the time it was AS levels. So that bumped up my grade, so I did okay overall, but didn't really have that direction of what I wanted to do. Really loved law, and went down a path of doing a law degree just because I was kind of good at it at A-level. But really, looking back, I wish I'd done an English degree ‘cause that was really where my passion was. So I always loved reading, but went down the path of a law degree not that it's ever coming round, and I really enjoyed doing my degree, but I think deep down I knew that I probably didn't want to do anything with it. And I'm not a legal person. I really wanted to help people, so if I'd have gone down a route of using my degree, it would have always been to help people, support them. But yeah, did my degree and then I went into working in a Jobcentre. So I've always worked from being sort of 13, I always had jobs, I was always looking at ways to make money. I used to collect the milk money from my dad. I was a pot washer. I was a waitress, I worked in a bar. I worked in superdrug when I was at college. I always had a job, and I feel like that really came in well for me with my career and how I've progressed. So I really want to sit and count how many jobs I've had. And I keep meaning to do it because with the work I do now, I think that would be really great thing to sort of share with young people. I have done every single job going and I just see I really enjoyed work. So yeah, I went down the route of a law degree and whilst I was at uni in the summer, I would go and work in the job centre on like a temp contract. So that was like my first taste of like a proper grown up job, like within an office. And then I carried on working there when I left uni, because I graduated right at the height of the financial recession. So when we had all the banks and the collapse. So I, I mean, had that not happened, I may have gone down a legal route, but at the time it was so competitive because there wasn't as many jobs, because there were laying people off, because we were in the midst of this recession. So I really just took the job in the job centre, you know, 21 years old, fresh out of uni, thinking that I knew everything and that I knew everything about life and experience. And then - met all of these people that were on benefits and met lots of different people. It really opened my eyes to what people go through and how some people live. And yeah, it taught me a lot. So I'm really grateful. I was really grateful for the opportunity, actually. So when I worked in the job centre, I worked there for quite a while, and then I went to work for another sort of employment based organisation before going back to the job centre so I thought I stayed in that remit for a few years. And then I sort of moved into PR and marketing, and then I ended up going into education and doing marketing again. So I went down that route, went and worked in a school, another school and do sort of like student recruiter marketing and really loved it, started a family, got married, decided to go back to university, do a master's in marketing for some reason [laughs] because I like a challenge. So I did that. And then I fell pregnant with my second child and had to do my dissertation and everything. Then we had Covid, so I sort of extended my master's quite a bit, but I got that done. I got a distinction and I was so proud of myself. It's probably the hardest thing that I've ever done, having to go back and do that Masters, and to get a distinction was just amazing. And then I sort of decided that I wanted to work more within marketing, took a job for a charity called Shore Trust, which was set up to support disabled people back into work. But actually its remit is much wider. So it was all about supporting disadvantaged and vulnerable people to upskill or into work which was um appropriate for them. So I went to work for a national charity and that really taught me a lot. And I got to work on some fantastic projects. It introduced me into the world of care and care leavers, a cause which is really, really close to my heart. There's so many injustices within the care system and how vulnerable young people are treated, and the real lottery of how, of how their care path goes. So that's something that was really fortunate to work on, like a national project and a not for profit organisation that actually supports young people. So that ignited my passion with that. And then just Power of Women came along out of nowhere, and I just saw it and I thought, mm that sounds like a bit of me. And it's in the local area. I'll get to support people working in this area, you know, Teesside and surrounding areas whereas I was really doing a lot of work in London and in the Midlands and all over in my previous job at Shore Trust so I kind of thought. Right. Yeah. Let's just go through and see what happened and I ended up getting the job. [laughs] Lynne [Interviewer] So can you tell me a bit about the Power of Women and Jane that set it up? Sophie [Interviewee] Yes. I didn't ever get to meet Jane, sadly, but I've heard a lot about her and obviously she is the main reason why Power of Women exist. So in 2016, there was a report that said Middlesbrough is the worst place to grow up a girl. So at the time, Professor Jane Turner, who was Pro-Vice-Chancellor at Teesside University and also the champion for gender equality, I believe, at the university, she was really outraged by this report and couldn't believe that, you know, we had this tagline for Middlesbrough and how unfair that was and how we were really failing girls in this area if that was the sort of title we had, and she really believed that it was the business community's collective and moral responsibility to tackle this head on and provide more opportunities for young people and show them what a great place it is to be on Teesside and work here. And the opportunities that are here. So Power of Women was born. But sadly, Jane was diagnosed with cervical cancer and passed away just as it was set up. So really everything we do at Power now is in the legacy of Jane and in her memory. And that's something which is really important to us and our board. So there's been lots of bumps along the way, where we've looked at going in different directions and doing different things. But Jane's legacy and what she wanted and why Power was set up is at the heart of everything that we do, and it's something which really guides us when we're looking at changing programs, expanding programs, etc.. Lynne [Interviewer] So what sort of things does Power of Women do? Sophie [Interviewee] So our main program that we offer is a primary school program. And the reason for that is because all of the research says that by age seven, our girls and boys start to form limiting beliefs about what they can do based on gender. So it might be that they think that’s a boy job, that's a girl job. So we really wanted to develop a primary school program that really tackled that and made them believe they could do anything they want it to be. So we do that through an in-school program, and then we take them out of school and do a much more intensive work with them, which is around what we call development days. So they're focused on things like networking and leadership, strengths, personal qualities, soft skills as we know them, but as we know they're actually powerful skills and skills that you really need to be successful in life. You might come out of school with top grades, but if you can’t hold a conversation, if you're not confident, if you don't have self-belief, that's really going to limit you in your career. And how much you go on to achieve in life. So it's all about developing those skills which we know are so important. So the primary school program runs over the academic year, and we also do lots of visits to local businesses and not just local, We go to Cambridge University. Anything aspirational, anything that's linked to Teesside, or any business that will have us really that we think fits with our program. We will visit anything that we think is going to be beneficial to our young people. And then we started developing a program as well, where we go into secondary and FE colleges and very much the same, just take in relatable local role models and getting them to speak to young people and just be real about their journeys and what they've achieved and how they've achieved. I think that we're all guilty of sometimes seeing someone that's really successful and thinking, making assumptions about them, or they might be this, they might be that, when actually a lot of our role models have grown up in the same estates as children in our schools, or, you know, they've had setbacks, they’ve had challenges, and they will really be open in how they speak to young people and, you know, and be honest about their journey. And the young people really appreciate that. I think that's one thing from the program. Even in primary school, the insights that young people have, we give them a platform to share their thoughts and ideas when often with children they don’t have that. So they don’t get to use their voice, but we really respect their voice and we get them to use it and share their thoughts and they blow me away every time, because they come out with such incredible points of view, opinions, thoughts, you know, looking at things from a different way that I might not have looked at it. So yeah, it's amazing. I love being a part of it. And equally, I love having our role models. We have over 150 now registered and it's growing all of the time. We want the role models to be as diverse as possible. So it's not just about women in STEM [Science, Technology, Engineering, and Mathematics] It's about all of the jobs that you can do. That's what it's about for me. Yes. Okay. That might be an, an amazing byproduct of this, that more women go into male dominated industries. Of course, that would be wonderful. But it's actually about just doing what makes you happy and doing anything that you want to do. Because, yeah, because you want to and you can. So yeah, it's not just about us saying - go into this industry are raising awareness of that. It's just about saying explore opportunities. Have the confidence to say yes to opportunity. Erm…build your network because you always say your network is your net worth. If you can meet new people, that's going to open doors for you and be confident and believe in yourself. And they’re all the skills we just want to pass on to our young people, to help them to be as successful as possible. Lynne [Interviewer] What sort of challenges to face as an organisation then? Sophie [Interviewee] Funding is a massive problem, so we don't get any regular funding- so we’re a community interest company, so we don't receive any regular grant funding. We don't get any statutory funding. So it's really us going out, speaking to businesses, getting corporate sponsorship, applying for little bids whenever we can. But in events, so we run lots and lots of events for women in business because we recognize that just because you're an adult, doesn’t mean, oh, that's great.now, I don't need any personal development. I don't need to work at any of those skills. I've got it all figured out, and we know that sadly, that isn't the case. You become an adult, and we still have all the same issues as we do as children and young people, we are just expected to have it all together. So our networking group has really…the safe space where women can come along, and we do lots of personal development opportunities, such as imposter syndrome workshop. We're looking at digital detox. You know, the pressures that women face in business and how we can help them tackle that, and also just be a part of a group which understands and gets it. And we share stories of other women in business. We do sort of like fireside chat spotlights. Yeah. And that's a great way of us reaching our mission and values of making Teesside a better place for women and girls to live and grow up, but also provides us with income because we can charge, like the ticket price in order to be able to come down to our events. So it's kind of a method of fundraising for us, but aligns with our vision and mission as well. So I would say like the biggest challenge yeah is probably funding. Another challenge is just time and resources. So similar to funding really in that I'm the only full time member of staff and we have a voluntary board. So we rely on a lot of goodwill and support from volunteers and others who really believe in what we do. And I think that's what's so special about POW is that when people get it, they get it, you know, and there's lots of people who don't get it. And that's absolutely fine. You know, I think gender, it can be a bit of a…contentious issue and we hear the word power of women. And sometimes I say the colour drain out of people's faces because it's like Power of Women- what’s that? Especially some men. But, we know, we're all about male allyship, and we truly believe that equality benefits everybody. It's not just about women, it's about everyone in society. It means that men are able to have the same opportunities as women in terms of sort of paternity, for example. So it's not just about women having equality, it's about men of equality too, and we’re really keen to get that message out. Lynne [Interviewer] What are the highlights? Sophie [Interviewee] Ahhh there’s loads of highlights. Some days it's really difficult and I'm up against it and it's really busy. Whenever I go to any event that we run, whether that's a business event or an event in school. Honestly, like, I come away just feeling so uplifted and so happy and just really believe in what we do and seeing the difference. So yeah, just hearing from young people in their testimonials. So when we've done work in secondary and FE we've run those half days, we've had comments like it's been the best day at school ever. I feel so grateful that these role models have come in, that it's really empowering. And you just see, it's really hard to sometimes measure the impact of what we do. So I think that is a challenge. And it also means that sometimes you can't always see how far you've come with these events. I mean, we'd absolutely love to eventually do some sort of longitudinal research where we could maybe study our young people from primary right the way through at different points and see how much impact that work that we're doing has. But, you know, it's not just about what we're doing. It's other organisations as well. And we really believe in collaborative working. So there's other organisations in the area doing fabulous work. And I truly believe that the more intervention that young people can have, the more it's going to benefit them. So, um, you know, Power of Women isn't just the answer for that group of children. It's about constantly them having that opportunity to do different things. And there's so many great organisations in the area that are doing other wonderful things as well. And it is really a group effort, and we're all trying to achieve the same results at the end of the day. So it's all about collaborative working and us all working together for the outcome of young people. But yeah, just hearing the comments from young people, the fact that we've grown from five schools in our first year to now being at 24 primary schools, that's brilliant. We just want to grow. I mean, our dream would be to be in every primary school in Tees Valley, one day so that all children are having this opportunity. That's what the young ambassadors always say when we ask them for feedback, they just say they've loved it all, but they think that all children should have the opportunity, which, you know, it brings with it its logistical issues. But, you know, that's something for us to aim at, for sure. And so I'd love to just have more contact with as many schools as possible and just share the message and make sure young people are having as many opportunities as possible, not just in the classroom, but outside of the classroom, so that they can understand what's on offer and really develop their personal skills, which is so important. Lynne [Interviewer] So who inspires you? Sophie [Interviewee] Oh…[sighs] Erm who inspires me? Honestly, since I've started in this job, which I'm coming up to my second year and I say this all the time to people, like, that I work with closely, I cannot believe how much I've grown in that time. And I feel so fortunate to be in this community that I didn't even know existed until I started at POW. So within Teesside, it's a really small business community compared to some cities for example, but it's so inspiring and I can't believe the stories and like the, just the voices of women that I get to be in the same room as, it’s so inspiring. So I wouldn't say there's one person who massively inspires me, but there's a whole group of business women in Teesside who are doing amazing things, who will support you, who are there on the end of a phone if you need any advice. You know, as I said, I work on my own a lot, but I know that if I have a problem, I also want to bounce an idea. I can just pick up the phone and speak to this amazing group of women who I really trust and whose opinion I value. So yeah, I think, just the Tees business community, everyone wants to support each other. I haven't found any instances where there's been any sort of badness, to be honest, which is really, really good. You’re more anonymous in sort of cities. And you can go to networking and you can go to events and then you might not ever see that person again. Whereas in Teesside you go to events and you get to know people and they become your colleagues, they become your friends. You know, a lot of these people I spent more time with than I do my actual friends…[laughs] But, yeah, my group chat of friends keeps me going for sure, my family as well- obviously my mum is a massive inspiration, and my sister, yeah, there's just so many amazing women on Teesside and I think the great thing about the business community is that everybody wants to help and everybody really does value what we're doing at POW. So that's just yeah, amazing. [laughs] Lynne [Interviewer] So you've talked about the young women that you work for in schools and you've got a young family yourself. What are your hopes for them? Sophie [Interviewee] Oh, you know, I have a boy and I have a girl. So I kind of see it from both sides. And I have so many worries for them. And I mean, my little boy, I worry about him, I worry about his mental health. I worry about the stereotypes that are put on young men. And, you know, there's a lot about this at the moment with misogyny and being online. And you just hope that for him especially, I hope that he feels really proud of who he is and that he's able to articulate how he's feeling and that he knows it's okay to be sad and to be vulnerable, because I feel like we have this group of boys at the moment where, yeah, it's not okay to be like that. So that's my fears for him and being online as well I do worry massively about that. And as for my, my little girl as well, you know, she comes home already and she's five and she'll say things like “oh but the boys weren’t very nice to me today.” She seems to play with all the boys Lynne [Interviewer] [laughs] Sophie [Interviewee] Which I don't know because she's got an older brother, but yeah, she likes football. And she said they were saying that girls aren’t strong, so we still have, like, from a very young age- girls can do this, boys can't do this. And I just hope that they know that that isn't true. And I hope that I'm doing my best thing as a parent in order to try and eliminate a lot of that and show them that it doesn't matter if you are a girl and that you can do whatever you want to do, regardless of gender. So my hopes for them are that they have confidence that they believe in themselves and that they do hard things. Because I think that's one thing since I started in this job, like it's pushed me out of my comfort zone massively, and because I've been pushed out of my comfort zone, I've grown as a person and it just makes me excited about the future and thinking, wow, what will I go on to achieve? And things that would have scared me probably two years ago. Now I can do quite easily and I'm confident to do them. So I just hope that my children are able to have that personal development opportunity where they can believe in themselves and they'll just do the scary things, will do the hard things, and they'll push through rather than just stay in within a comfort zone and limiting themselves. So just really that they have the belief that they're able to do whatever they want. Yeah. Lynne [Interviewer] Yeah, I'm coming to the end now… Sophie [Interviewee] [laughs] Lynne [Interviewer] …thank you for being so open- is there anything else that you want to say? Sophie [Interviewee] I think that as much as, you know, Power is about girls, I think it's really important that, you know, we have started to involve boys in our program because it's really scary what's out there with violence against women and girls and misogyny. And ultimately the only way that we are going to change that is by educating and involving boys into the conversation and making them feel like we value their voice as well. So that's something that we're really proud of at Power, and I think that is what is going to make the difference going forward and change things. You know, some of the amazing comments that come out of the boys and the young girls mouths, when they’re on the development days about the future, I honestly do feel so hopeful for the future if we've got this generation coming through because they're so eloquent, so they understand the issues, and I really believe that they're going to be a force of nature when they're grown up. I really hope that. And just a massive thank you to all of our role models who are involved, empowering all of our supporters, because, you know, it takes a village to raise a child. And, you know, some of our young people, ah… live in really disadvantaged areas, and they've got a lot of issues, so our role models and supporters that are involved in Power they’re really making a difference to help raise aspirations, to help unlock potential and really show young people a brighter future that they can have on Teesside as well. OUTRO: Thank you for listening to Periplum’s Trailblazers Podcasts funded by the National Lottery Heritage Fund. To listen to more of the series, and follow our projects visit our website at periplumheritage.com